General Meeting

22 February 2008

MINUTES

 

Spokesperson:              Marian Stokes                                              

Minutes:                        Sheila Vango 

Guest Speaker:             Göksel Saydam, Tax Consultant

Marian opened the meeting by thanking everyone for attending the today and commented that she had not thought to be here again discussing a major issue which is impacting the foreign buying community. In her naivety in 2005 when the group was started she imagined a few weeks of lobbying and getting a few simple issues ironed out! Likewise the introduction of the Property Complaints Office (PCO) late last year was hopefully a signal that things were going to get better and settle down and now the whole stamp duty issue has galvanised the group to action again.

As advertised we have a tax expert coming to talk to us about the TRNC Property Tax procedures and responsibilities today. He was booked before the latest issue surrounding Stamp Duty/Contract Tax (ST/CT) broke. We will discuss that issue as well today but as most of you are aware we are exploring the possibility of suing the lawyers or the lawyer’s disciplinary body – Baro – for failing to protect our interests and do the job they have all been paid for. At this stage can I take a straw poll, via a show of hands, of who feel this is an appropriate course of action to take? Ok, pretty unanimous, thank you. We will return to this subject at the end of our meeting. In the meantime, I do have a few messages I wish to communicate and hope to clear them before our guest speaker gets here.

The PCO, regardless of what some complainants and bulletin boards think, are our biggest ally. They have diligently looked at every case that has been reported to them and by finding that what we are saying is true, have given credence to our cause. We are no longer Whinging Brits, but victims of bad practices.

One of the things that became obvious to us when we started the group was that many of the problems that we have encountered could have been prevented if the lawyers had done their jobs properly and given us accurate advice. The PCO investigations are confirming that the lawyers could indeed have prevented a lot of the problems people are experiencing. At this point I must say to you all, it is easy to tar everyone with the same brush, and that would be unfair, our investigations show that the same 7 or 8 lawyers are involved time after time again – we do not want to paint the whole profession as unprofessional. We are talking about 7 or 8 lawyers who bring into disrepute the other good lawyers practising in the TRNC. We all know who they are, we just can’t name them at this stage.

The only way to make progress and achieve results is by lobbying anyone who can help us. This has been proven by the success now being encountered by the Aga Group, people’s homes are being built again and an end is in sight to the plight of hundreds caught in the middle of that human disaster. Ron, Hugo, Pat, Josh and Des kept plodding on, when many others had given up, the solution in effect today may not satisfy everyone’s concerns but it is a huge step forward and they should be congratulated. Likewise the new Estate Agents Law (EAL) is, we feel, a result for our group as it addresses so many of the issues we have been lobbying about for the past two and a half years. The sad truth is, I have come to realise that many of us will be battling for many years to come to sort our own individual issues, but as a group we have helped prevent many other buyers falling into the traps we have become enmeshed in and I guess here we go again, because the lawyers have let us down badly and the efforts we make today and in the future, to address that issue will benefit those coming after us, but it has to be done.

If I could just return to the PCO for a moment, I am starting to hear criticism of the office that some people do not feel that their particular concern is being addressed. There is a bulletin board that seems to delight in mocking the office, (for which they did not lobby) by pointing out their shortcomings. I would urge you all to ignore this negativity, the office does an awful lot of work to get each file to a workable condition, they take your story, they verify all the facts, when permissions were applied for and given, they talk to your lawyer, your builder, they talk to land registry and the architects and engineers, they talk to Kibtek and the water board and city planning etc etc then they write their findings up and get the files ready to go before the committee who then try to find a solution to your particular problem. It is time consuming work, any of you who have tried the simple task of renewing your residency know it takes some 6 – 12 working hours over 2/3 weeks to achieve. MOTing the car can take a day – so give them a break. At present they have 200 plus cases to look at and these are being added to daily. If you have a property related problem, you must go to them are report your situation, each new case adds weight to the pressure we are applying to get things changed but be patient; Rome was not built in a day.

On the subject of bulletin boards, I am surprised at the amount of conflicting and misinformation that gets reported on them which leads to a lot of stress to others reading the board. I know at times it is reported as a result of something someone’s lawyer or builder has said and is seeking clarification, but I would urge you to check any rumour out before posting the notice – call me or call the PCO and we will find out the true situation – but this in itself may take time.

There is a report that the Stamp Duty/Contract Tax (ST/CT) amnesty is in place – and I hope it is true – but the government don’t seem to know about it! I have placed calls to people who should know and they don’t, so I am currently waiting for confirmation of the situation.

As our guest speaker is stuck in traffic, I would like to talk about the Permission to Purchase (PTP) situation. There are still coming through and so are the refusals. A worrying pattern is emerging whereby those with Turkish Title deed land are being refused – no lawyer will tell you that of course, (but we see the evidence) and of course, those too close to military land. We are currently seeking talks with the government to discuss these very issues and find a solution, a long lease may be one answer, but we shall see. The fall back position in the past for the government has been – well you should not have bought until you got your PTP, you broke the law and that brings us back to the lawyers and their neglecting to tell most of us that it was a law to begin with!

If you live here and do not have your PTP go to the office, quote your number and ask to see your file, ask the staff where you are in the process, so many are stalled because paperwork has missing information, check that there is nothing wrong with your file, preventing your PTP from being processed. They have thousands waiting processing, the incomplete ones languish – do not rely on your lawyer to do it just because he/she has been paid to do the job.

The new EAL is starting to have a positive effect, although at the moment, many of you have found you have a large tax liability! The fact that we (past buyers) can register our contracts at land registry without our PTP being granted is a wonderful advancement. Sadly the side effect of that is that only stamped (SD/CT paid) contracts can be lodged. Thousands of people are being asked, not only to pay for a tax they did not know had to be paid, but are been penalised for not paying it on time and then the lawyers who should have prevented that situation for existing by telling you about your tax liability in the first place, want to be paid to carry out the work for you!

In the past week we have heard of some people – mainly within the construction industry, who do not like the new EAL – as the registration of deeds is showing many of them up in a bad light as people discover upon presenting their contracts to the Land Registry that the builder has mortgaged the land. They can no longer get away with asking Estate Agents to market a property unless they are completely up front – with any mortgage declared to all interested buyers, with Permission to Build Permits (PTBP) in place, electric and water applications applied for and granted, access being available – and this is impacting the way they have traditionally done business. We as an organisation pledge our support for the new law and have made our feelings known to the Prime Minister’s Office and to the Attorney General that to soften or abolish some parts of this law will be met with opposition from our group. We fully support the Estate Agents Union and applaud the way they have embraced this law and strengthened our faith in their ability to provide a secure way to buy within the TRNC. Please tell any potential buyers you encounter to ONLY buy from a registered Estate Agent and thereby put the unregistered Estate Agents out of business.

Unregistered = unregulated = unprotected buyers.

Our guest speaker has arrived, so without much further ado let me tell you about Göksel Saydam who has come to talk to us about Property taxes and hopefully clear up any questions you may have on the subject. He graduated from the American Academy in 1962 with honours, he then completed his accountancy examinations at the London Chamber of Commerce and was appointed a tax officer in the Republic of Cyprus (ROC) (as it was then in 1963) and he held various positions within the tax office until 1983. That year he won a British Government Scholarship and in the academic year 1983/4 he attended a post graduate course at London Commonwealth Tax Office Centre regarding the British Taxation System and Practices – so he knows his stuff! In 1985 he was appointed the Director General of Revenue and Tax office of the TRNC. He has lectured at various universities on this subject and in 1997 he published a handbook entitled TRNC Taxation and Tax Laws. He retired in 1996 from public duty and opened his own company as a Certified Public Accountant and Tax Consultant. Please welcome Mr Göksel Saydam .....

Guest Speaker Mr Göksel Saydam

Ladies and Gentleman, I have been asked to attend today by Mrs Marian to tell you about the property tax applicable when buying property in the TRNC. First of all I would like you to know that the TRNC tax system is basically identical to the British Overseas Taxation system which was introduced when the ROC was formed in 1960. The basic concept of taxation is universal, you buy something for £1 and sell it for £2 and pay tax on the £1 profit at the rate demanded at the time. In property this is not so simple and the profit is not calculated in this way. To start with there are two types of land dealers.

First there is the professional land dealer – all companies, firms and persons who deal constantly (deriving their income) with property business come under this group.

The calculation of taxable profit regarding Professional dealers is 25% of the Selling Price or Assessed Value determined by the Land Registry Office (LRO), whichever is the higher. This is taken as the estimated Net Profit on the transaction - this is not your problem this is a cost of running such a business in the TRNC.

Example

House highest valuation      £100,000

Estimated Profit                 £25,000

Tax at 25%                      £6,250 or 6.25% of the valuation price

As a professional seller this tax liability is offset against KDV paid on purchases and expenses. The tax office demands the tax payable as the transactions take place each month this is called withholding tax, any overpayments as the profit used in the calculation is estimated only will be sorted once audited accounts are received at the end of the financial year. The tax office works this way so that KDV is collected in a timely manner and businesses send in their audited accounts to collect any tax overpayment.

The second category of seller is the amateur seller; they do not derive their main income from property transactions. To be an amateur you cannot sell more than 3 properties in a calendar year. These people are usually selling property they have inherited from their ancestors.

Example

House highest valuation      £100,000

Estimated Profit                 £25,000

The amateur seller receives a 30% one off discount so is taxed on 70% of the estimated profit at a rate of 20%.

Estimated profit less 30%    £17,500

KDV tax at 20%                 £3,500 or 3.5% of the valuation price

As an amateur the seller cannot offset this KDV against his taxable income.

Lastly there is a sort of third category, if a person sells one house on one plot of land for the first time after July 1982 – they are exempt from income tax. So if you sell your house and move to another or return to the UK, you will not pay income tax on that first sale.

It is important that you know which type of seller you are dealing with as the tax liability for both is different and may affect the sales price.

Now, it has come to my attention that some of the professional sellers (the only category I shall now deal with) are trying to switch this withholding tax onto the buyer – this is not right, there is no such legislation that says this. This tax is sometimes called capital gains tax – whatever description they give it, it is their responsibility to pay it and no clause in a contract can overrule the responsibilities that the tax laws declare. It is impossible for a clause in a contract to say that ‘anyoldbody’ will pay this tax – is the tax office going to trace my brother in New York if I state that he is going to pay it – No – the responsibility lies with the seller. I am sure if you went to a court on this point, you would win because the tax legislation on this matter is very clear.

As you know here property transactions are not sorted in a day, it may be years until the transaction is completed fully and transfer of title takes place. There have been issues whereby, due to the increase in property valuations that the contract price is much lower that the estimated value of the property some 4/5 years later. This is being looked at.

Are there any questions at this point?

Q:      My builder is claiming he cannot pay the taxes due, what can I do about this?

A:      Don’t pay it, it is not your responsibility, this is his problem.

R:       But it is my problem, if his taxes are not paid I cannot get my title deeds.

A:       Ah, I understand, the taxes are linked. We link them in this way to force payment of taxes. The difficulty is that the seller may owe lots of taxes not related to your property and they all have to be cleared. How do you know if you are paying his total tax bill? This is not good. This must be something your lawyer can help with. Incidentally, when taxes are paid at the Tax Office, a receipt is issued showing the total paid and another sheet of breakdown taxes is given, you should ask for a copy of both and ensure the taxes being paid relate to your property. You are both there paying your share of the taxes so make sure you get these things.

The contract is important however for the payment of the SD/CT which is payable by the buyer. It is calculated at 0.5% of the contract price. So, on a £100,000 contract this equates to £500. If that tax is not paid within one month of the contract being signed, it doubles to 1% or £1000 and if it is still not paid after six months this rises to 1.5% which is £1,500. This is your responsibility to pay as the buyer. This law has been in existence since 1963 and not one full stop has been changed in this law since this time. This SD/CT can be paid in one of two ways, it is paid by special stamps, government postage stamps if you like, which you have to purchase from the post office. For large bills this is not very practical and you can pay in cash and then the last page of the contract is stamped as paid in full.

MS:    There is great confusion about SD/CT at the moment as many of us are just discovering that our contracts have not been stamped, because we did not know we had to take them to be stamped and indeed many of us were not even in the country to stamp them, having signed our contracts and returned to the UK – who is responsible in this case.

GS:     You are, look if you travel the wrong way down a one way street, the policeman may accept that you did not see the sign, but you have a responsibility to look out for the sign. Now, of course, you do at least know that one way streets exist, so if you did not know about this tax liability then the professional sellers and your lawyers have let you down.

Q:      There is much speculation at the moment that a general amnesty may be declared to help all the innocent buyers and give them a chance to pay this tax at 0.5%. Do you know anything about that?

Several members of the audience stepped up to relate their experiences in the past 24 hours, including Kate Smith, who had been to pay SD/CT on behalf of her clients, however these all varied.

MS:    I was informed just before this meeting started that this information was out in the general public, I have place calls to various people who should be in the know, such as the Estate Agents union, who need this information to communicate to their members and no one knows. This appears to be common knowledge of which the government cannot confirm. Please let us continue and as soon as we can get this information to you we will.

GS:     Sometimes the government to avoid a big tax mess which has occurred where misunderstanding has caused people inconvenience and is therefore unfair, will issue a transitional amnesty to smooth the path of a new law. In this country we have laws and we have regulations. Regulations are usually issued by the Council of Ministers, this is very practical as they can pass a regulation much quicker than government can pass a law. However, if they do this the change to a regulation must be published in the Official Gazette and the next day it will become law and will be enforced– I read the Official Gazette every day and I have not see a change to this regulation. Changes to tax laws are not normally under the jurisdiction of the C OF M, but needs the authority of parliament, so this is very confusing. Government has to present a Bill for this, so if this is proposed today, you should see it be effective in about 45 days! Amnesties are fraught with problems – is it a general amnesty or a limited amnesty, what do people do who paid the higher rate hours before the amnesty come in? I would listen to Marian’s advice and wait until she can clarify the situation and get something in writing.

Can I ask you all to do something for me and the budget of this country? Get a receipt for everything you buy, especially with property as a great deal of tax is due to be collected from sellers and lawyers, from all that furniture you buy, the cars you buy – I do not understand why you would give away your proof of payment by not asking for receipts, it leaves you very vulnerable. Please always get a receipt.

Q:      It has been said that some district tax offices are insisting that the contract be in Turkish – do you know if this is true?

A:       The only people concerned with the wording on a contract is the buyer and the seller, as long as they are happy to sign it, it could be in Russian for all the tax man cares! As long as the contract price is clearly written in Latin format that we all understand, the tax calculation can be made.

MS:    If any of you encounter problems such as these, do not lose your temper, phone me with details of the problem and we can get someone in authority to talk to the tax office and clarify the mater for them – maybe not that second but within a few hours, yavas, yavas.

Q:      Do I have to have my original contract to be signed?

A:      Yes you do.

Q:      What if my solicitor will not give me my original contract?

A:      What right have they to refuse, you have paid for that contract – demand it.

Q:      What happens if I pay my SD/CT and then my PTP is refused by the C of M?

A:      You are unfortunate.

MS:    I know SD/CT is a hot potato at the moment but Göksel has other taxes to tell you about, so can we leave this subject for the moment and move on

GS:     I just want to add on this subject that the contract tax applies to purchases from the amateur seller too. So the SD/CT is paid very early on the buying process, the next set of taxes to impact the buyer comes once the title deed can be transferred.

There is a Property Transfer Fee of 6% to be paid, calculated on the assessed value determined by the LRO. It is not calculated on your contract value. There is a special rule that can be applied once only if you buy property here of 3%. It is your choice when you invoke this special rate – if you buy a small house and then buy a bigger one and then a few years later, buy another bigger one – you might choose to pay the 3% on the most expensive of these properties. However as most of you are only going to buy one house in the TRNC, you should take that option on that property. So for the majority of you, if you house is valued at £100000.00 by the LRO, you will pay the reduced rate of £% which is £3000.00.

If your property if located with the boundaries of a Municipality, then you must pay the Municipality Tax of 1% of the property transfer fee. In our example the property transfer fee is £3,000.00 so £300 will be due to your local municipality.

The last tax that you are due to pay is the %5 KDV on the sales price, on a £100000.00 property this is £5000.00. The seller must give you an invoice and you are responsible for the KDV element as the final purchaser of those goods. So you are buying a house at £xxxx plus KDV.

Now I know that there is some ambiguity here when it comes to property purchase. If your contract does not set out that you as the buyer are responsible for this tax then it is reasonable to expect that the sales price INCLUDES KDV. If you have paid the full sales price to your seller, then they have collected the KDV due and the liability is no longer yours. This is why it is important to have receipts.

For example if you buy petrol, you pay KDV on that sale as an integral part of the sale, it is collected by the garage that sold the petrol and passed onto the taxman - the same principle applies on house purchase.

If the seller is an amateur no KDV is payable on the sale, it is not his primary business and he is not registered to pay KDV. Do not be fooled into paying something you are not due to pay!

So to round all this up on a house with a contract price of £80,000.00 and a LRO valuation of £100,000.00

SD/CT is payable on the contract value of £80,000.00

if paid in the first month this will be £80,000.00 x 0.5% = £400.00

Months 2 to 6, this will be £80,000.00 x 1% = £800.00

Months 6 +, this will be £80,000.00 x 1.5% = £1,200.00

Property Transfer Tax is payable on the LRO valuation of £100,000.00

This can be paid at the standard rate of £100,000.00 x 6% = £6,000.00

Or it can be paid at the one off price of £100,000.00 x 3% = £3,000.00

Municipality Tax at 1% of the LRO valuation of £100,000.00

If the standard rate of 6% is paid of £6,000 this is £6000.000 x 1% = £60.00

If the one off price of 3% is paid of £3,000.00 x 1% = £30.00

KDV – this is paid at 5% of the Contract Price of £80,000.00

If you contract clearly sets out that you are due to pay this then the cost will be

£80,000.00 x 5% = £4000.00

If however your contract does not state that this is the case, you can assume (and argue to the tax office) that the contract price, which you have paid in full, included any KDV due.

So at best in this situation you need to set aside £3,430.00 and at worst £11,260.00 – quite a difference you will agree.

Then lastly there is a Title Deed Fee to have everything put in your name of 13.50YTL.

Just out of interest, other relevant Property Transfer Fees are

a)     Gift to a child                                      2%

b)     Gift to a husband or wife                       4%

c)     Gift to a grandson or granddaughter         4%

Just to confuse things further, as reported on our website thanks to Ismet Ustunur, there was a tax amnesty introduced in 2005 concerning contracts which were signed prior to December 2004. This amnesty offers an 80% discount on the 1% penalty for not paying the SD/CT within 6 months. Effectively this means that if you signed your contract before December 2004 and now want to pay the tax on it, you will pay the 0.5% due plus a penalty of 0.02% = 0.7% in total of the contract value. In the case of our property at £100,000.00 this equates to £700.00.

How many of you who have a pre December 2004 contract received a letter from your solicitors requesting the tax money due, at 1.5%. I wonder how many of them would have returned your overpayment to you if you sent them the 1.5% total they are requesting.

Lastly, it was brought to our attention that a new directive is being issued by the tax office, concerning the point at which the KDV becomes payable on the contract. Traditionally this has been once PTP has been granted and the LRO have made their valuations, title is transfer and the contract is concluded. Now it is being mooted that this transfer physically takes place when the keys are exchanged so this is the point at which these taxes become due. We can see this is a sensible suggestion as transfer of keys is likely to happen long before PTP comes through, it is timelier to collect taxes this way and will help the tax coffers immensely. But what are the ramifications to us the buyers – we will be paying taxes on properties we do not own in law. Once again this is something we will have to verify – if you get asked for the KDV on your Contract by your seller in order to receive the keys – please call us.

Just to add to the confusion – MS stated that she had been informed that the contract price was now to be used for the transfer tax calculation as of 02 January 2008.

GS stated he knew there was a campaign to make this so as it was not fair to value property some years later and this had made life hard for many people as they had not set aside enough money to cover the tax liability – this is unfair to both sellers and buyers, it is logical to use a set figure and collect the taxes due in a timely manner and everyone knows with certainty what their tax liability would be. – again we will clarify.

And the last word on Taxation...if you do not have the Koçan (title deed) for your house, you cannot in law be liable for the annual Property Tax – the equivalent of our Council Tax. Now before you all dash out and crucify your builder common sense has to prevail. You are the user of the facilities, if I as a landowner was paying this on your behalf; I think I would present you with the bill for payments made on a property you enjoy when I came to transfer title to you. We have more important battles to fight, I think.

Q:      I have reached the stage where I am able to transfer title, but when I approached my seller, he tells me he does not have the money to pay his taxes. What can I do?

A:       This means that the seller owes money to the tax office, it may not even be for your property as if he has a tax bill outstanding that must be cleared before he can enjoy the benefit from a sale.

MS:    Yes, but if the sellers tax bill does not get paid, the buyer cannot get legal title to his property, this is the problem. Our members find themselves being blackmailed into paying the seller more money in order to get title.

GS:     Now I understand, if the seller owes money to the government from other sources of taxation these will come to light when he tries to move the title from himself to you. The tax office will say you have money from this sale, so settle the tax liability. Of course, I see now that you may have given your seller all the monies due sometime in the past, so they may not have set aside the Property Transfer Tax, or not set aside enough. This is a serious problem; you must take this issue to the Prime Minister’s Office it is a unfair thing and you should complain.

Q:      My situation is that I want my individual title deeds, but my seller does not want to pay his tax, so is deliberately delaying the parcalisation so that he does not have to pay his tax. What can I do?

MS:    Complain to the PCO, the more incidents they have of loopholes that are being exploited, the sooner the holes can be plugged. They could check to see if the seller has even started a parcalisation project – at least you could call his bluff if he has not.

GS:     You do not have to be present when a builder pays his tax on the transfer; you simply need proof of his payment, like a receipt. The receipt he gives you should pertain to your property only. I think it might be wise to ask you lawyers to check a seller’s tax liability before signing an agreement with him! If he is a bad taxpayer, maybe you can have some sort of penalty clause written to penalise him if you cannot get your deeds because he is a late taxpayer.

Q:      I am lucky enough to have my deeds, am I still liable for SD/CT?

MS:    No, to get your deeds the tax liability must be discharged first. I suspect that when your seller or solicitor took you to the tax office to pay, your outstanding tax (SD/CT) was paid at the penalty rate of 1.5% and you were unaware of it. By the way, if you can, go with your seller or solicitor to these offices, do not hand them your cash - hand it over direct at the tax office when they have calculated your liability – and keep your receipts.

Q:      I have bought land only at this stage. When I find a builder am I liable for all these taxes?

GS:     You will pay property transfer taxes on the land. When you employ an architect to design your house, his bill will include KDV. When you find a builder and enter a contract with him to build the house, he will be paying KDV on all the materials purchased. He too will charge you KDV in turn by presenting you with an invoice. If he does not do these he is breach of the law and working in what you know as the black economy, one day someone will ask questions about this house, for example when you want to register it on your land. You will not be liable for the tax, but you could be in trouble with the authorities for tax evasion. When you have a house built, with or without buying the land from the same person, you must protect yourself and make sure the KDV position is clear and get it written into any agreement – inclusive/exclusive of KDV. In both instances you as the buyer are liable to pay. However, if there is ever a dispute about payment from the tax office you can show the price was inclusive of KDV and the tax man can knock on the door of the builder and leave you in peace to enjoy your house.

Q:      A lot of the sellers will not give receipts, they avoid the issue by saying you can prove payment, so why do you need receipts.

GS:     Proving payment is not good enough, what did you buy with it? You must insist.

Q:      They say send me the money to my bank and I will write you a receipt, but it never comes.

GS:     Then do not send them the next instalment until you have the 1st receipt, it seems to me that the sellers are taking advantage of a fundamental rule of business in the TRNC – receipts must be issued.

MS:    You can report these people to the tax office and they will investigate. Again it takes a long time, but if everyone reported their own seller, I am sure the scale of the problem would be realised and the same names would keep coming to the fore.

GS:     No, not to the tax office, I expect the seller’s sister works there – take it to the Prime Minister’s Office that you now have instead.

SV:     What proof do you need to take?

GS:     Bank statements and things like that, this is a very powerful instrument in your hands and you should do this as a group, tax avoidance is a crime.

Q:      We have had to finish our house ourselves although we employed a builder, where do we stand?

GS:     Please Mister (wearily) until today I knew of about 5 different cases where people cheat, now after some 90 minutes with you I am overwhelmed by what I hear. I think I am glad I am retired, and there is a great need for this group, you have to stick together to put pressure on the government.

Q:      I am buying in an apartment block and am due to get my keys, I am being asked for the KDV, but the block is not finished, I am told I am the only one who refuses to pay out of 40, but I am not comfortable with it. I feel I am being railroaded.

MS:    Railroading is very common, I guess you could ask to see the proof that all the other KDV is paid as each flat should be paid individually, but this is one of these new directives that we want to get confirmed. Go to the PCO with this query.

Q:      If I pay these taxes and my PTP is refused, can I get my money back?

GS:     No, it is not an overpayment of tax; it is the tax applicable at the time. This is why the transfer tax should not be paid until the transfer is complete; payment of KDV at the exchange of keys is open to this sort of problem.

MS:    I am sorry folks, but we have used up the time the Pia Bella can give us very rapidly and I need to go back to the question of lawyers. I can still see lots of raised hands with questions for Göksel, so can I ask that you get them to me in writing and I will try to get an answer for you. For the moment can we thank Göksel for his informative and entertaining talk tonight?

Göksel was warmly applauded by the assembly and stepped down.

A lively open discussion continued for approximately 45 minutes, mostly regarding buyers experiences of negligent lawyers.

The meeting closed at 18:00 hours.